Using chain rule to differentiate $f(x)=a(x)b(x)$?Derivative rulesIntuition of multivariable chain ruleDifferentiate using the chain rule. Do not simplify.Correct simultanous application of chain and product ruleChain rule extravaganza - how to derive this?A puzzling “failure” of the Chain RuleOn the chain ruleChain rule when applying L'Hopital's ruleChain rule doubtHow to use the chain rule for change of variablePartial derivatives and normal derivative combined in the chain rule

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Using chain rule to differentiate $f(x)=a(x)b(x)$?


Derivative rulesIntuition of multivariable chain ruleDifferentiate using the chain rule. Do not simplify.Correct simultanous application of chain and product ruleChain rule extravaganza - how to derive this?A puzzling “failure” of the Chain RuleOn the chain ruleChain rule when applying L'Hopital's ruleChain rule doubtHow to use the chain rule for change of variablePartial derivatives and normal derivative combined in the chain rule













5












$begingroup$


Why can I not apply the chain rule to a product in the following way.



If we have some product:



$$f(x)=a(x)b(x)$$



Consider the multiplication of b by a as another’s function so that:



$$f(b(x))=ab$$



So that



$fracdfdx = f’(b)b’(x)$



Something feels very wrong. But I can’t put my finger on it.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 8




    $begingroup$
    There may be a $g$ with $g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)$. But you probably don't want to call it "$f$".
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    May 17 at 14:58






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    beginalign 2a(x)b(x)=a(x)^2+b(x)^2-(a(x)-b(x))^2 endalign And you know the derivative of $a(x)^2$ by chain rule.
    $endgroup$
    – Bach
    May 17 at 15:02















5












$begingroup$


Why can I not apply the chain rule to a product in the following way.



If we have some product:



$$f(x)=a(x)b(x)$$



Consider the multiplication of b by a as another’s function so that:



$$f(b(x))=ab$$



So that



$fracdfdx = f’(b)b’(x)$



Something feels very wrong. But I can’t put my finger on it.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 8




    $begingroup$
    There may be a $g$ with $g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)$. But you probably don't want to call it "$f$".
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    May 17 at 14:58






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    beginalign 2a(x)b(x)=a(x)^2+b(x)^2-(a(x)-b(x))^2 endalign And you know the derivative of $a(x)^2$ by chain rule.
    $endgroup$
    – Bach
    May 17 at 15:02













5












5








5


2



$begingroup$


Why can I not apply the chain rule to a product in the following way.



If we have some product:



$$f(x)=a(x)b(x)$$



Consider the multiplication of b by a as another’s function so that:



$$f(b(x))=ab$$



So that



$fracdfdx = f’(b)b’(x)$



Something feels very wrong. But I can’t put my finger on it.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




Why can I not apply the chain rule to a product in the following way.



If we have some product:



$$f(x)=a(x)b(x)$$



Consider the multiplication of b by a as another’s function so that:



$$f(b(x))=ab$$



So that



$fracdfdx = f’(b)b’(x)$



Something feels very wrong. But I can’t put my finger on it.







derivatives chain-rule






share|cite|improve this question















share|cite|improve this question













share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited May 18 at 15:19









user21820

41k545166




41k545166










asked May 17 at 14:52









Jake RoseJake Rose

476




476







  • 8




    $begingroup$
    There may be a $g$ with $g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)$. But you probably don't want to call it "$f$".
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    May 17 at 14:58






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    beginalign 2a(x)b(x)=a(x)^2+b(x)^2-(a(x)-b(x))^2 endalign And you know the derivative of $a(x)^2$ by chain rule.
    $endgroup$
    – Bach
    May 17 at 15:02












  • 8




    $begingroup$
    There may be a $g$ with $g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)$. But you probably don't want to call it "$f$".
    $endgroup$
    – David Mitra
    May 17 at 14:58






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    beginalign 2a(x)b(x)=a(x)^2+b(x)^2-(a(x)-b(x))^2 endalign And you know the derivative of $a(x)^2$ by chain rule.
    $endgroup$
    – Bach
    May 17 at 15:02







8




8




$begingroup$
There may be a $g$ with $g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)$. But you probably don't want to call it "$f$".
$endgroup$
– David Mitra
May 17 at 14:58




$begingroup$
There may be a $g$ with $g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)$. But you probably don't want to call it "$f$".
$endgroup$
– David Mitra
May 17 at 14:58




2




2




$begingroup$
beginalign 2a(x)b(x)=a(x)^2+b(x)^2-(a(x)-b(x))^2 endalign And you know the derivative of $a(x)^2$ by chain rule.
$endgroup$
– Bach
May 17 at 15:02




$begingroup$
beginalign 2a(x)b(x)=a(x)^2+b(x)^2-(a(x)-b(x))^2 endalign And you know the derivative of $a(x)^2$ by chain rule.
$endgroup$
– Bach
May 17 at 15:02










7 Answers
7






active

oldest

votes


















18












$begingroup$

Write $mu(u,v)=uv$. Then
$$
mu_1(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial u(u,v)= v,
quad
mu_2(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial v(u,v)= u
$$



Now $f(x)=mu(a(x),b(x))$ and so $$f'(x)=mu_1(a(x),b(x))a'(x)+mu_2(a(x),b(x))b'(x)=b(x)a'(x)+a(x)b'(x)$$



This is the multiplication rule using the chain rule.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$




















    13












    $begingroup$

    You can't use the chain rule because this is not a composition. Just calling it one does not make it one. For example, suppose $a(x)=x+1$ and $b(x)=x^2$. Then your first line says
    $$
    f(x) = x^2(x+1) = x^3+ x^2
    $$

    so
    $$
    f(b(x)) = f(x^2) = (x^2)^3 + (x^2)^2
    $$

    so not the same as "$ab$".






    share|cite|improve this answer









    $endgroup$








    • 1




      $begingroup$
      Is there a way to write a product of functions as a composition?
      $endgroup$
      – Jake Rose
      May 17 at 16:14






    • 3




      $begingroup$
      Short answer: no. Longer answer: yes, but you have to make things pretty convoluted. See the answer from @lbf . In general, try to think more about the meaning of the derivative as a rate of change, less about which rule to apply. See math.stackexchange.com/questions/3227026/derivative-rules/…
      $endgroup$
      – Ethan Bolker
      May 17 at 17:48



















    5












    $begingroup$

    If $f(x)=a(x)x$ (it looks as if this is what you have in mind), then $fbigl(b(x)bigr)$ is equal to $abigl(b(x)bigr)b(x)$, instead of $a(x)b(x)$.






    share|cite|improve this answer









    $endgroup$




















      4












      $begingroup$

      Also re-interpreting as per David Mitra's comment, that you are looking for some function $g$ such that $g(b(x)) = a(x)b(x)$ (where $g$ is something different from $f(x) = a(x)b(x)$).



      Your problem here is that then $a(x) = frac g(b(x))b(x)$. I.e., the value of $a(x)$ depends on that of $b(x)$. What happens when $b(x_1) = b(x_2)$ but $a(x_1) ne a(x_2)$? For example, suppose $b(x) = c$ for some constant $c$, but $a(x) = x$? Clearly no such $g$ can exist.



      So you cannot turn every product into a composition of single variable functions. However, as lhf has pointed out, multiplication itself is a multivariate function, and the product rule is actually just an application of the multivariate chain rule.






      share|cite|improve this answer









      $endgroup$




















        3












        $begingroup$

        Alternatively, if we know the chain rule and the derivative of the logarithm as well as the fact that $log(ab)=log(a)+log(b)$, we get that
        beginalign
        left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
        &= left(log(f(x))+log(g(x))right)'\
        &= fracf'(x)f(x)+fracg'(x)g(x)
        endalign

        But we also have that
        beginalign
        left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
        &= fracleft(f(x)g(x)right)'f(x)g(x)
        endalign






        share|cite|improve this answer









        $endgroup$




















          0












          $begingroup$

          Based on the remark given by David Mitra in the comments, you are considering:
          $$
          g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)
          $$

          which implies we must have
          $$
          g(x)=a(b^-1(x))x
          $$

          Finding the derivative of this $g$ will be a bit messy.
          $$
          frac ddxg(x)=a'(b^-1(x))cdotfrac 1b'(b^-1(x))cdot x+a(b^-1(x))
          $$

          and so plugging in $b(x)$ and applying the chain rule gives us:
          $$
          beginalign
          fracddxg(b(x))&=left(a'(x)cdotfrac 1b'(x)cdot b(x)+a(x)right)cdot b'(x)\
          &=a'(x)b(x)+a(x)b'(x)
          endalign
          $$






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$












          • $begingroup$
            Have you not inherently used the product rule when you differentiated g?
            $endgroup$
            – Jake Rose
            May 17 at 16:12






          • 1




            $begingroup$
            @JakeRose: Explicitly I have indeed. Then I might not be sure what you were asking, sorry for that.
            $endgroup$
            – String
            May 17 at 16:14


















          0












          $begingroup$

          If you can find such a composition $Acirc b = a(x)b(x)$, then the chain rule gives you the product rule. You can find $Acirc b$ just if b is invertible.




          • Because $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are both functions of $x$, you might not be able to find a "multiplication function" $A$ that lets you write the product $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.



            This is because $A$ only sees the output of the function $b(x)$. It doesn't see what $x$ is. If it can't see what $x$ is (or figure it out based on the value of $b(x)$), then it can't compute $a(x)$ and so it can't compute $a(x)b(x)$.



          • When you can recover the value of $x$ from the value of $b(x)$, we say that $b$ is invertible.



          • If $b$ is invertible, then it has an inverse $b^-1$ which recovers the value of $x$. So, if $y=b(x)$ then $b^-1(y) = x$.



            If $b$ is invertible, then you can define the function $A(y) equiv a(b^-1(y)) cdot y$.



          • Then notice that by definition, $A(b(x)) = a(b^-1(b(x))) cdot b(x) = a(x)b(x)$, exactly as we want it. We have written $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.


          • When we take the derivative using the chain rule, we find that $fracddxA(b(x)) = a^prime(x)b(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)$, exactly as you want. Though because the definition of $A$ depends on a product, you either have to use the product rule anyways to differentiate it, or use the limit definition of the derivative to compute it.



          In multivariable calculus, the chain rule directly gives you the product rule.



          What you might be looking for, after all, is a way to use the chain rule as a fundamental tool for proving all of the other rules such as the product rule. You can do this with multivariable calculus.



          • The multiplication function is $M(u,v) = uv$. Its derivative is $DM(u,v) = langle v, urangle$.


          • If your two functions are $a(x)$ and $b(x)$, then their product is $g(x) = a(x)b(x)$.


          • We can write $g$ as a composition: $g(x) = M(a(x), b(x))$.


          • The derivative of $g$ is therefore the derivative of $M(a(x), b(x))$---and we can compute this latter derivative using the chain rule.


          • By the chain rule,


          begineqnarray*
          Dleft[M(a(x),b(x))right] &= DM( a(x), b(x))bullet Dlangle a(x), b(x)rangle\
          &= langle b(x), a(x)rangle bullet langle a^prime(x), b^prime(x)rangle\
          &= b(x)a^prime(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)
          endeqnarray*






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$













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            7 Answers
            7






            active

            oldest

            votes








            7 Answers
            7






            active

            oldest

            votes









            active

            oldest

            votes






            active

            oldest

            votes









            18












            $begingroup$

            Write $mu(u,v)=uv$. Then
            $$
            mu_1(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial u(u,v)= v,
            quad
            mu_2(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial v(u,v)= u
            $$



            Now $f(x)=mu(a(x),b(x))$ and so $$f'(x)=mu_1(a(x),b(x))a'(x)+mu_2(a(x),b(x))b'(x)=b(x)a'(x)+a(x)b'(x)$$



            This is the multiplication rule using the chain rule.






            share|cite|improve this answer









            $endgroup$

















              18












              $begingroup$

              Write $mu(u,v)=uv$. Then
              $$
              mu_1(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial u(u,v)= v,
              quad
              mu_2(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial v(u,v)= u
              $$



              Now $f(x)=mu(a(x),b(x))$ and so $$f'(x)=mu_1(a(x),b(x))a'(x)+mu_2(a(x),b(x))b'(x)=b(x)a'(x)+a(x)b'(x)$$



              This is the multiplication rule using the chain rule.






              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$















                18












                18








                18





                $begingroup$

                Write $mu(u,v)=uv$. Then
                $$
                mu_1(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial u(u,v)= v,
                quad
                mu_2(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial v(u,v)= u
                $$



                Now $f(x)=mu(a(x),b(x))$ and so $$f'(x)=mu_1(a(x),b(x))a'(x)+mu_2(a(x),b(x))b'(x)=b(x)a'(x)+a(x)b'(x)$$



                This is the multiplication rule using the chain rule.






                share|cite|improve this answer









                $endgroup$



                Write $mu(u,v)=uv$. Then
                $$
                mu_1(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial u(u,v)= v,
                quad
                mu_2(u,v) = fracpartialmupartial v(u,v)= u
                $$



                Now $f(x)=mu(a(x),b(x))$ and so $$f'(x)=mu_1(a(x),b(x))a'(x)+mu_2(a(x),b(x))b'(x)=b(x)a'(x)+a(x)b'(x)$$



                This is the multiplication rule using the chain rule.







                share|cite|improve this answer












                share|cite|improve this answer



                share|cite|improve this answer










                answered May 17 at 15:02









                lhflhf

                170k11174411




                170k11174411





















                    13












                    $begingroup$

                    You can't use the chain rule because this is not a composition. Just calling it one does not make it one. For example, suppose $a(x)=x+1$ and $b(x)=x^2$. Then your first line says
                    $$
                    f(x) = x^2(x+1) = x^3+ x^2
                    $$

                    so
                    $$
                    f(b(x)) = f(x^2) = (x^2)^3 + (x^2)^2
                    $$

                    so not the same as "$ab$".






                    share|cite|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$








                    • 1




                      $begingroup$
                      Is there a way to write a product of functions as a composition?
                      $endgroup$
                      – Jake Rose
                      May 17 at 16:14






                    • 3




                      $begingroup$
                      Short answer: no. Longer answer: yes, but you have to make things pretty convoluted. See the answer from @lbf . In general, try to think more about the meaning of the derivative as a rate of change, less about which rule to apply. See math.stackexchange.com/questions/3227026/derivative-rules/…
                      $endgroup$
                      – Ethan Bolker
                      May 17 at 17:48
















                    13












                    $begingroup$

                    You can't use the chain rule because this is not a composition. Just calling it one does not make it one. For example, suppose $a(x)=x+1$ and $b(x)=x^2$. Then your first line says
                    $$
                    f(x) = x^2(x+1) = x^3+ x^2
                    $$

                    so
                    $$
                    f(b(x)) = f(x^2) = (x^2)^3 + (x^2)^2
                    $$

                    so not the same as "$ab$".






                    share|cite|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$








                    • 1




                      $begingroup$
                      Is there a way to write a product of functions as a composition?
                      $endgroup$
                      – Jake Rose
                      May 17 at 16:14






                    • 3




                      $begingroup$
                      Short answer: no. Longer answer: yes, but you have to make things pretty convoluted. See the answer from @lbf . In general, try to think more about the meaning of the derivative as a rate of change, less about which rule to apply. See math.stackexchange.com/questions/3227026/derivative-rules/…
                      $endgroup$
                      – Ethan Bolker
                      May 17 at 17:48














                    13












                    13








                    13





                    $begingroup$

                    You can't use the chain rule because this is not a composition. Just calling it one does not make it one. For example, suppose $a(x)=x+1$ and $b(x)=x^2$. Then your first line says
                    $$
                    f(x) = x^2(x+1) = x^3+ x^2
                    $$

                    so
                    $$
                    f(b(x)) = f(x^2) = (x^2)^3 + (x^2)^2
                    $$

                    so not the same as "$ab$".






                    share|cite|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$



                    You can't use the chain rule because this is not a composition. Just calling it one does not make it one. For example, suppose $a(x)=x+1$ and $b(x)=x^2$. Then your first line says
                    $$
                    f(x) = x^2(x+1) = x^3+ x^2
                    $$

                    so
                    $$
                    f(b(x)) = f(x^2) = (x^2)^3 + (x^2)^2
                    $$

                    so not the same as "$ab$".







                    share|cite|improve this answer












                    share|cite|improve this answer



                    share|cite|improve this answer










                    answered May 17 at 15:00









                    Ethan BolkerEthan Bolker

                    49.6k557127




                    49.6k557127







                    • 1




                      $begingroup$
                      Is there a way to write a product of functions as a composition?
                      $endgroup$
                      – Jake Rose
                      May 17 at 16:14






                    • 3




                      $begingroup$
                      Short answer: no. Longer answer: yes, but you have to make things pretty convoluted. See the answer from @lbf . In general, try to think more about the meaning of the derivative as a rate of change, less about which rule to apply. See math.stackexchange.com/questions/3227026/derivative-rules/…
                      $endgroup$
                      – Ethan Bolker
                      May 17 at 17:48













                    • 1




                      $begingroup$
                      Is there a way to write a product of functions as a composition?
                      $endgroup$
                      – Jake Rose
                      May 17 at 16:14






                    • 3




                      $begingroup$
                      Short answer: no. Longer answer: yes, but you have to make things pretty convoluted. See the answer from @lbf . In general, try to think more about the meaning of the derivative as a rate of change, less about which rule to apply. See math.stackexchange.com/questions/3227026/derivative-rules/…
                      $endgroup$
                      – Ethan Bolker
                      May 17 at 17:48








                    1




                    1




                    $begingroup$
                    Is there a way to write a product of functions as a composition?
                    $endgroup$
                    – Jake Rose
                    May 17 at 16:14




                    $begingroup$
                    Is there a way to write a product of functions as a composition?
                    $endgroup$
                    – Jake Rose
                    May 17 at 16:14




                    3




                    3




                    $begingroup$
                    Short answer: no. Longer answer: yes, but you have to make things pretty convoluted. See the answer from @lbf . In general, try to think more about the meaning of the derivative as a rate of change, less about which rule to apply. See math.stackexchange.com/questions/3227026/derivative-rules/…
                    $endgroup$
                    – Ethan Bolker
                    May 17 at 17:48





                    $begingroup$
                    Short answer: no. Longer answer: yes, but you have to make things pretty convoluted. See the answer from @lbf . In general, try to think more about the meaning of the derivative as a rate of change, less about which rule to apply. See math.stackexchange.com/questions/3227026/derivative-rules/…
                    $endgroup$
                    – Ethan Bolker
                    May 17 at 17:48












                    5












                    $begingroup$

                    If $f(x)=a(x)x$ (it looks as if this is what you have in mind), then $fbigl(b(x)bigr)$ is equal to $abigl(b(x)bigr)b(x)$, instead of $a(x)b(x)$.






                    share|cite|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$

















                      5












                      $begingroup$

                      If $f(x)=a(x)x$ (it looks as if this is what you have in mind), then $fbigl(b(x)bigr)$ is equal to $abigl(b(x)bigr)b(x)$, instead of $a(x)b(x)$.






                      share|cite|improve this answer









                      $endgroup$















                        5












                        5








                        5





                        $begingroup$

                        If $f(x)=a(x)x$ (it looks as if this is what you have in mind), then $fbigl(b(x)bigr)$ is equal to $abigl(b(x)bigr)b(x)$, instead of $a(x)b(x)$.






                        share|cite|improve this answer









                        $endgroup$



                        If $f(x)=a(x)x$ (it looks as if this is what you have in mind), then $fbigl(b(x)bigr)$ is equal to $abigl(b(x)bigr)b(x)$, instead of $a(x)b(x)$.







                        share|cite|improve this answer












                        share|cite|improve this answer



                        share|cite|improve this answer










                        answered May 17 at 15:00









                        José Carlos SantosJosé Carlos Santos

                        188k24145261




                        188k24145261





















                            4












                            $begingroup$

                            Also re-interpreting as per David Mitra's comment, that you are looking for some function $g$ such that $g(b(x)) = a(x)b(x)$ (where $g$ is something different from $f(x) = a(x)b(x)$).



                            Your problem here is that then $a(x) = frac g(b(x))b(x)$. I.e., the value of $a(x)$ depends on that of $b(x)$. What happens when $b(x_1) = b(x_2)$ but $a(x_1) ne a(x_2)$? For example, suppose $b(x) = c$ for some constant $c$, but $a(x) = x$? Clearly no such $g$ can exist.



                            So you cannot turn every product into a composition of single variable functions. However, as lhf has pointed out, multiplication itself is a multivariate function, and the product rule is actually just an application of the multivariate chain rule.






                            share|cite|improve this answer









                            $endgroup$

















                              4












                              $begingroup$

                              Also re-interpreting as per David Mitra's comment, that you are looking for some function $g$ such that $g(b(x)) = a(x)b(x)$ (where $g$ is something different from $f(x) = a(x)b(x)$).



                              Your problem here is that then $a(x) = frac g(b(x))b(x)$. I.e., the value of $a(x)$ depends on that of $b(x)$. What happens when $b(x_1) = b(x_2)$ but $a(x_1) ne a(x_2)$? For example, suppose $b(x) = c$ for some constant $c$, but $a(x) = x$? Clearly no such $g$ can exist.



                              So you cannot turn every product into a composition of single variable functions. However, as lhf has pointed out, multiplication itself is a multivariate function, and the product rule is actually just an application of the multivariate chain rule.






                              share|cite|improve this answer









                              $endgroup$















                                4












                                4








                                4





                                $begingroup$

                                Also re-interpreting as per David Mitra's comment, that you are looking for some function $g$ such that $g(b(x)) = a(x)b(x)$ (where $g$ is something different from $f(x) = a(x)b(x)$).



                                Your problem here is that then $a(x) = frac g(b(x))b(x)$. I.e., the value of $a(x)$ depends on that of $b(x)$. What happens when $b(x_1) = b(x_2)$ but $a(x_1) ne a(x_2)$? For example, suppose $b(x) = c$ for some constant $c$, but $a(x) = x$? Clearly no such $g$ can exist.



                                So you cannot turn every product into a composition of single variable functions. However, as lhf has pointed out, multiplication itself is a multivariate function, and the product rule is actually just an application of the multivariate chain rule.






                                share|cite|improve this answer









                                $endgroup$



                                Also re-interpreting as per David Mitra's comment, that you are looking for some function $g$ such that $g(b(x)) = a(x)b(x)$ (where $g$ is something different from $f(x) = a(x)b(x)$).



                                Your problem here is that then $a(x) = frac g(b(x))b(x)$. I.e., the value of $a(x)$ depends on that of $b(x)$. What happens when $b(x_1) = b(x_2)$ but $a(x_1) ne a(x_2)$? For example, suppose $b(x) = c$ for some constant $c$, but $a(x) = x$? Clearly no such $g$ can exist.



                                So you cannot turn every product into a composition of single variable functions. However, as lhf has pointed out, multiplication itself is a multivariate function, and the product rule is actually just an application of the multivariate chain rule.







                                share|cite|improve this answer












                                share|cite|improve this answer



                                share|cite|improve this answer










                                answered May 17 at 19:59









                                Paul SinclairPaul Sinclair

                                21.3k21644




                                21.3k21644





















                                    3












                                    $begingroup$

                                    Alternatively, if we know the chain rule and the derivative of the logarithm as well as the fact that $log(ab)=log(a)+log(b)$, we get that
                                    beginalign
                                    left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                    &= left(log(f(x))+log(g(x))right)'\
                                    &= fracf'(x)f(x)+fracg'(x)g(x)
                                    endalign

                                    But we also have that
                                    beginalign
                                    left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                    &= fracleft(f(x)g(x)right)'f(x)g(x)
                                    endalign






                                    share|cite|improve this answer









                                    $endgroup$

















                                      3












                                      $begingroup$

                                      Alternatively, if we know the chain rule and the derivative of the logarithm as well as the fact that $log(ab)=log(a)+log(b)$, we get that
                                      beginalign
                                      left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                      &= left(log(f(x))+log(g(x))right)'\
                                      &= fracf'(x)f(x)+fracg'(x)g(x)
                                      endalign

                                      But we also have that
                                      beginalign
                                      left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                      &= fracleft(f(x)g(x)right)'f(x)g(x)
                                      endalign






                                      share|cite|improve this answer









                                      $endgroup$















                                        3












                                        3








                                        3





                                        $begingroup$

                                        Alternatively, if we know the chain rule and the derivative of the logarithm as well as the fact that $log(ab)=log(a)+log(b)$, we get that
                                        beginalign
                                        left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                        &= left(log(f(x))+log(g(x))right)'\
                                        &= fracf'(x)f(x)+fracg'(x)g(x)
                                        endalign

                                        But we also have that
                                        beginalign
                                        left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                        &= fracleft(f(x)g(x)right)'f(x)g(x)
                                        endalign






                                        share|cite|improve this answer









                                        $endgroup$



                                        Alternatively, if we know the chain rule and the derivative of the logarithm as well as the fact that $log(ab)=log(a)+log(b)$, we get that
                                        beginalign
                                        left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                        &= left(log(f(x))+log(g(x))right)'\
                                        &= fracf'(x)f(x)+fracg'(x)g(x)
                                        endalign

                                        But we also have that
                                        beginalign
                                        left(log(f(x)g(x)right)
                                        &= fracleft(f(x)g(x)right)'f(x)g(x)
                                        endalign







                                        share|cite|improve this answer












                                        share|cite|improve this answer



                                        share|cite|improve this answer










                                        answered May 17 at 21:09









                                        BotondBotond

                                        7,38331035




                                        7,38331035





















                                            0












                                            $begingroup$

                                            Based on the remark given by David Mitra in the comments, you are considering:
                                            $$
                                            g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)
                                            $$

                                            which implies we must have
                                            $$
                                            g(x)=a(b^-1(x))x
                                            $$

                                            Finding the derivative of this $g$ will be a bit messy.
                                            $$
                                            frac ddxg(x)=a'(b^-1(x))cdotfrac 1b'(b^-1(x))cdot x+a(b^-1(x))
                                            $$

                                            and so plugging in $b(x)$ and applying the chain rule gives us:
                                            $$
                                            beginalign
                                            fracddxg(b(x))&=left(a'(x)cdotfrac 1b'(x)cdot b(x)+a(x)right)cdot b'(x)\
                                            &=a'(x)b(x)+a(x)b'(x)
                                            endalign
                                            $$






                                            share|cite|improve this answer









                                            $endgroup$












                                            • $begingroup$
                                              Have you not inherently used the product rule when you differentiated g?
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – Jake Rose
                                              May 17 at 16:12






                                            • 1




                                              $begingroup$
                                              @JakeRose: Explicitly I have indeed. Then I might not be sure what you were asking, sorry for that.
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – String
                                              May 17 at 16:14















                                            0












                                            $begingroup$

                                            Based on the remark given by David Mitra in the comments, you are considering:
                                            $$
                                            g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)
                                            $$

                                            which implies we must have
                                            $$
                                            g(x)=a(b^-1(x))x
                                            $$

                                            Finding the derivative of this $g$ will be a bit messy.
                                            $$
                                            frac ddxg(x)=a'(b^-1(x))cdotfrac 1b'(b^-1(x))cdot x+a(b^-1(x))
                                            $$

                                            and so plugging in $b(x)$ and applying the chain rule gives us:
                                            $$
                                            beginalign
                                            fracddxg(b(x))&=left(a'(x)cdotfrac 1b'(x)cdot b(x)+a(x)right)cdot b'(x)\
                                            &=a'(x)b(x)+a(x)b'(x)
                                            endalign
                                            $$






                                            share|cite|improve this answer









                                            $endgroup$












                                            • $begingroup$
                                              Have you not inherently used the product rule when you differentiated g?
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – Jake Rose
                                              May 17 at 16:12






                                            • 1




                                              $begingroup$
                                              @JakeRose: Explicitly I have indeed. Then I might not be sure what you were asking, sorry for that.
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – String
                                              May 17 at 16:14













                                            0












                                            0








                                            0





                                            $begingroup$

                                            Based on the remark given by David Mitra in the comments, you are considering:
                                            $$
                                            g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)
                                            $$

                                            which implies we must have
                                            $$
                                            g(x)=a(b^-1(x))x
                                            $$

                                            Finding the derivative of this $g$ will be a bit messy.
                                            $$
                                            frac ddxg(x)=a'(b^-1(x))cdotfrac 1b'(b^-1(x))cdot x+a(b^-1(x))
                                            $$

                                            and so plugging in $b(x)$ and applying the chain rule gives us:
                                            $$
                                            beginalign
                                            fracddxg(b(x))&=left(a'(x)cdotfrac 1b'(x)cdot b(x)+a(x)right)cdot b'(x)\
                                            &=a'(x)b(x)+a(x)b'(x)
                                            endalign
                                            $$






                                            share|cite|improve this answer









                                            $endgroup$



                                            Based on the remark given by David Mitra in the comments, you are considering:
                                            $$
                                            g(b(x))=a(x)b(x)
                                            $$

                                            which implies we must have
                                            $$
                                            g(x)=a(b^-1(x))x
                                            $$

                                            Finding the derivative of this $g$ will be a bit messy.
                                            $$
                                            frac ddxg(x)=a'(b^-1(x))cdotfrac 1b'(b^-1(x))cdot x+a(b^-1(x))
                                            $$

                                            and so plugging in $b(x)$ and applying the chain rule gives us:
                                            $$
                                            beginalign
                                            fracddxg(b(x))&=left(a'(x)cdotfrac 1b'(x)cdot b(x)+a(x)right)cdot b'(x)\
                                            &=a'(x)b(x)+a(x)b'(x)
                                            endalign
                                            $$







                                            share|cite|improve this answer












                                            share|cite|improve this answer



                                            share|cite|improve this answer










                                            answered May 17 at 15:20









                                            StringString

                                            14k32758




                                            14k32758











                                            • $begingroup$
                                              Have you not inherently used the product rule when you differentiated g?
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – Jake Rose
                                              May 17 at 16:12






                                            • 1




                                              $begingroup$
                                              @JakeRose: Explicitly I have indeed. Then I might not be sure what you were asking, sorry for that.
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – String
                                              May 17 at 16:14
















                                            • $begingroup$
                                              Have you not inherently used the product rule when you differentiated g?
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – Jake Rose
                                              May 17 at 16:12






                                            • 1




                                              $begingroup$
                                              @JakeRose: Explicitly I have indeed. Then I might not be sure what you were asking, sorry for that.
                                              $endgroup$
                                              – String
                                              May 17 at 16:14















                                            $begingroup$
                                            Have you not inherently used the product rule when you differentiated g?
                                            $endgroup$
                                            – Jake Rose
                                            May 17 at 16:12




                                            $begingroup$
                                            Have you not inherently used the product rule when you differentiated g?
                                            $endgroup$
                                            – Jake Rose
                                            May 17 at 16:12




                                            1




                                            1




                                            $begingroup$
                                            @JakeRose: Explicitly I have indeed. Then I might not be sure what you were asking, sorry for that.
                                            $endgroup$
                                            – String
                                            May 17 at 16:14




                                            $begingroup$
                                            @JakeRose: Explicitly I have indeed. Then I might not be sure what you were asking, sorry for that.
                                            $endgroup$
                                            – String
                                            May 17 at 16:14











                                            0












                                            $begingroup$

                                            If you can find such a composition $Acirc b = a(x)b(x)$, then the chain rule gives you the product rule. You can find $Acirc b$ just if b is invertible.




                                            • Because $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are both functions of $x$, you might not be able to find a "multiplication function" $A$ that lets you write the product $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.



                                              This is because $A$ only sees the output of the function $b(x)$. It doesn't see what $x$ is. If it can't see what $x$ is (or figure it out based on the value of $b(x)$), then it can't compute $a(x)$ and so it can't compute $a(x)b(x)$.



                                            • When you can recover the value of $x$ from the value of $b(x)$, we say that $b$ is invertible.



                                            • If $b$ is invertible, then it has an inverse $b^-1$ which recovers the value of $x$. So, if $y=b(x)$ then $b^-1(y) = x$.



                                              If $b$ is invertible, then you can define the function $A(y) equiv a(b^-1(y)) cdot y$.



                                            • Then notice that by definition, $A(b(x)) = a(b^-1(b(x))) cdot b(x) = a(x)b(x)$, exactly as we want it. We have written $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.


                                            • When we take the derivative using the chain rule, we find that $fracddxA(b(x)) = a^prime(x)b(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)$, exactly as you want. Though because the definition of $A$ depends on a product, you either have to use the product rule anyways to differentiate it, or use the limit definition of the derivative to compute it.



                                            In multivariable calculus, the chain rule directly gives you the product rule.



                                            What you might be looking for, after all, is a way to use the chain rule as a fundamental tool for proving all of the other rules such as the product rule. You can do this with multivariable calculus.



                                            • The multiplication function is $M(u,v) = uv$. Its derivative is $DM(u,v) = langle v, urangle$.


                                            • If your two functions are $a(x)$ and $b(x)$, then their product is $g(x) = a(x)b(x)$.


                                            • We can write $g$ as a composition: $g(x) = M(a(x), b(x))$.


                                            • The derivative of $g$ is therefore the derivative of $M(a(x), b(x))$---and we can compute this latter derivative using the chain rule.


                                            • By the chain rule,


                                            begineqnarray*
                                            Dleft[M(a(x),b(x))right] &= DM( a(x), b(x))bullet Dlangle a(x), b(x)rangle\
                                            &= langle b(x), a(x)rangle bullet langle a^prime(x), b^prime(x)rangle\
                                            &= b(x)a^prime(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)
                                            endeqnarray*






                                            share|cite|improve this answer









                                            $endgroup$

















                                              0












                                              $begingroup$

                                              If you can find such a composition $Acirc b = a(x)b(x)$, then the chain rule gives you the product rule. You can find $Acirc b$ just if b is invertible.




                                              • Because $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are both functions of $x$, you might not be able to find a "multiplication function" $A$ that lets you write the product $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.



                                                This is because $A$ only sees the output of the function $b(x)$. It doesn't see what $x$ is. If it can't see what $x$ is (or figure it out based on the value of $b(x)$), then it can't compute $a(x)$ and so it can't compute $a(x)b(x)$.



                                              • When you can recover the value of $x$ from the value of $b(x)$, we say that $b$ is invertible.



                                              • If $b$ is invertible, then it has an inverse $b^-1$ which recovers the value of $x$. So, if $y=b(x)$ then $b^-1(y) = x$.



                                                If $b$ is invertible, then you can define the function $A(y) equiv a(b^-1(y)) cdot y$.



                                              • Then notice that by definition, $A(b(x)) = a(b^-1(b(x))) cdot b(x) = a(x)b(x)$, exactly as we want it. We have written $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.


                                              • When we take the derivative using the chain rule, we find that $fracddxA(b(x)) = a^prime(x)b(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)$, exactly as you want. Though because the definition of $A$ depends on a product, you either have to use the product rule anyways to differentiate it, or use the limit definition of the derivative to compute it.



                                              In multivariable calculus, the chain rule directly gives you the product rule.



                                              What you might be looking for, after all, is a way to use the chain rule as a fundamental tool for proving all of the other rules such as the product rule. You can do this with multivariable calculus.



                                              • The multiplication function is $M(u,v) = uv$. Its derivative is $DM(u,v) = langle v, urangle$.


                                              • If your two functions are $a(x)$ and $b(x)$, then their product is $g(x) = a(x)b(x)$.


                                              • We can write $g$ as a composition: $g(x) = M(a(x), b(x))$.


                                              • The derivative of $g$ is therefore the derivative of $M(a(x), b(x))$---and we can compute this latter derivative using the chain rule.


                                              • By the chain rule,


                                              begineqnarray*
                                              Dleft[M(a(x),b(x))right] &= DM( a(x), b(x))bullet Dlangle a(x), b(x)rangle\
                                              &= langle b(x), a(x)rangle bullet langle a^prime(x), b^prime(x)rangle\
                                              &= b(x)a^prime(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)
                                              endeqnarray*






                                              share|cite|improve this answer









                                              $endgroup$















                                                0












                                                0








                                                0





                                                $begingroup$

                                                If you can find such a composition $Acirc b = a(x)b(x)$, then the chain rule gives you the product rule. You can find $Acirc b$ just if b is invertible.




                                                • Because $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are both functions of $x$, you might not be able to find a "multiplication function" $A$ that lets you write the product $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.



                                                  This is because $A$ only sees the output of the function $b(x)$. It doesn't see what $x$ is. If it can't see what $x$ is (or figure it out based on the value of $b(x)$), then it can't compute $a(x)$ and so it can't compute $a(x)b(x)$.



                                                • When you can recover the value of $x$ from the value of $b(x)$, we say that $b$ is invertible.



                                                • If $b$ is invertible, then it has an inverse $b^-1$ which recovers the value of $x$. So, if $y=b(x)$ then $b^-1(y) = x$.



                                                  If $b$ is invertible, then you can define the function $A(y) equiv a(b^-1(y)) cdot y$.



                                                • Then notice that by definition, $A(b(x)) = a(b^-1(b(x))) cdot b(x) = a(x)b(x)$, exactly as we want it. We have written $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.


                                                • When we take the derivative using the chain rule, we find that $fracddxA(b(x)) = a^prime(x)b(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)$, exactly as you want. Though because the definition of $A$ depends on a product, you either have to use the product rule anyways to differentiate it, or use the limit definition of the derivative to compute it.



                                                In multivariable calculus, the chain rule directly gives you the product rule.



                                                What you might be looking for, after all, is a way to use the chain rule as a fundamental tool for proving all of the other rules such as the product rule. You can do this with multivariable calculus.



                                                • The multiplication function is $M(u,v) = uv$. Its derivative is $DM(u,v) = langle v, urangle$.


                                                • If your two functions are $a(x)$ and $b(x)$, then their product is $g(x) = a(x)b(x)$.


                                                • We can write $g$ as a composition: $g(x) = M(a(x), b(x))$.


                                                • The derivative of $g$ is therefore the derivative of $M(a(x), b(x))$---and we can compute this latter derivative using the chain rule.


                                                • By the chain rule,


                                                begineqnarray*
                                                Dleft[M(a(x),b(x))right] &= DM( a(x), b(x))bullet Dlangle a(x), b(x)rangle\
                                                &= langle b(x), a(x)rangle bullet langle a^prime(x), b^prime(x)rangle\
                                                &= b(x)a^prime(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)
                                                endeqnarray*






                                                share|cite|improve this answer









                                                $endgroup$



                                                If you can find such a composition $Acirc b = a(x)b(x)$, then the chain rule gives you the product rule. You can find $Acirc b$ just if b is invertible.




                                                • Because $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are both functions of $x$, you might not be able to find a "multiplication function" $A$ that lets you write the product $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.



                                                  This is because $A$ only sees the output of the function $b(x)$. It doesn't see what $x$ is. If it can't see what $x$ is (or figure it out based on the value of $b(x)$), then it can't compute $a(x)$ and so it can't compute $a(x)b(x)$.



                                                • When you can recover the value of $x$ from the value of $b(x)$, we say that $b$ is invertible.



                                                • If $b$ is invertible, then it has an inverse $b^-1$ which recovers the value of $x$. So, if $y=b(x)$ then $b^-1(y) = x$.



                                                  If $b$ is invertible, then you can define the function $A(y) equiv a(b^-1(y)) cdot y$.



                                                • Then notice that by definition, $A(b(x)) = a(b^-1(b(x))) cdot b(x) = a(x)b(x)$, exactly as we want it. We have written $a(x)b(x)$ as a chain rule composition $A(b(x))$.


                                                • When we take the derivative using the chain rule, we find that $fracddxA(b(x)) = a^prime(x)b(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)$, exactly as you want. Though because the definition of $A$ depends on a product, you either have to use the product rule anyways to differentiate it, or use the limit definition of the derivative to compute it.



                                                In multivariable calculus, the chain rule directly gives you the product rule.



                                                What you might be looking for, after all, is a way to use the chain rule as a fundamental tool for proving all of the other rules such as the product rule. You can do this with multivariable calculus.



                                                • The multiplication function is $M(u,v) = uv$. Its derivative is $DM(u,v) = langle v, urangle$.


                                                • If your two functions are $a(x)$ and $b(x)$, then their product is $g(x) = a(x)b(x)$.


                                                • We can write $g$ as a composition: $g(x) = M(a(x), b(x))$.


                                                • The derivative of $g$ is therefore the derivative of $M(a(x), b(x))$---and we can compute this latter derivative using the chain rule.


                                                • By the chain rule,


                                                begineqnarray*
                                                Dleft[M(a(x),b(x))right] &= DM( a(x), b(x))bullet Dlangle a(x), b(x)rangle\
                                                &= langle b(x), a(x)rangle bullet langle a^prime(x), b^prime(x)rangle\
                                                &= b(x)a^prime(x) + a(x)b^prime(x)
                                                endeqnarray*







                                                share|cite|improve this answer












                                                share|cite|improve this answer



                                                share|cite|improve this answer










                                                answered May 22 at 6:50









                                                user326210user326210

                                                10.2k1027




                                                10.2k1027



























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