Do flaws still apply to a druid in Wild Shape?Soulmelds and Wild ShapeCan I employ Relentless Endurance while in Wild Shape?Detecting Wild Shape with a MythalIs equipment that merges into the Druid's Wild Shape form weightless?Do removed parts of a Druid's Wild Shape form persist after said Druid exits Wild Shape?Animal form with most grapple damage in wild shape formCan Polymorph be used to give a druid new Wild Shape forms?Do ability score improvements apply to a druid's wild shape?Enlarge Person and Wild Shape interactionReplacing Wild Shape (5e)
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Do flaws still apply to a druid in Wild Shape?
Soulmelds and Wild ShapeCan I employ Relentless Endurance while in Wild Shape?Detecting Wild Shape with a MythalIs equipment that merges into the Druid's Wild Shape form weightless?Do removed parts of a Druid's Wild Shape form persist after said Druid exits Wild Shape?Animal form with most grapple damage in wild shape formCan Polymorph be used to give a druid new Wild Shape forms?Do ability score improvements apply to a druid's wild shape?Enlarge Person and Wild Shape interactionReplacing Wild Shape (5e)
.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;
$begingroup$
There may be no consensus on this one given the fact that flaws are a variant rule but:
Do any flaws you have as a Druid still apply to your wild shaped form? I am aware that feats are situational so my guess is that flaws maybe situational as well.
dnd-3.5e druid wild-shape
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There may be no consensus on this one given the fact that flaws are a variant rule but:
Do any flaws you have as a Druid still apply to your wild shaped form? I am aware that feats are situational so my guess is that flaws maybe situational as well.
dnd-3.5e druid wild-shape
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There may be no consensus on this one given the fact that flaws are a variant rule but:
Do any flaws you have as a Druid still apply to your wild shaped form? I am aware that feats are situational so my guess is that flaws maybe situational as well.
dnd-3.5e druid wild-shape
$endgroup$
There may be no consensus on this one given the fact that flaws are a variant rule but:
Do any flaws you have as a Druid still apply to your wild shaped form? I am aware that feats are situational so my guess is that flaws maybe situational as well.
dnd-3.5e druid wild-shape
dnd-3.5e druid wild-shape
edited May 11 at 20:33
V2Blast
29.4k5106178
29.4k5106178
asked May 11 at 20:01
Connor ClarkeConnor Clarke
56611
56611
add a comment |
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Let’s start by establishing what rules we do have:
Wild Shape (Su)
At 5th level, [...] This ability functions like the alternate form special ability, except as noted here.
Nothing “noted here” says anything about feats.
Alternate Form
A creature with this special quality has the ability to assume one or more specific alternate forms. [...]
- Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to) [...] feats [...]
Again, nothing “elsewhere,” either in alternate form or wild shape, contradicts the general statement that the creatures retains its feats.
Prerequisites
Some feats have prerequisites. Your character must have the indicated ability score, class feature, feat, skill, base attack bonus, or other quality designated in order to select or use that feat. A character can gain a feat at the same level at which he or she gains the prerequisite.
A character can’t use a feat if he or she has lost a prerequisite.
Here is the only thing that suggests a druid might lose (the use of) a feat when using wild shape: if the druid loses the prerequisites for that feat. This might be due to changed ability scores, loss of features from the druid’s original form, or whatever else—see the full description of alternate form for a full list of things a druid might lose during wild shape, and compare that against the prerequisites of any feats the druid may have.
Now then,
Character Flaws
Flaws are like the flip side of feats. Whereas a feat enables a character to be better than normal at performing a task (or even to do something that normal characters can't), a flaw restricts a character's capabilities or imposes a penalty of some sort.
A player may select up to two flaws when creating a character. After 1st level, a character cannot take on additional flaws unless the game master specifically allows it (for examples of times when doing this might be appropriate, see Character Traits). Each flaw a player selects entitles his character to a bonus feat. In other words, when you create a character, if you select two flaws, you can also take two bonus feats beyond those your character would be normally entitled to.
Unlike traits, flaws are entirely negative in their impact on a character's capabilities.
So here we have flaws as “the flip side of feats,” and each functions like a “negative” feat, both in having a negative impact on your character and in allowing you to take another feat to balance it out. Moreover, remember what alternate form said: “Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to)”—this is where flaws would fall, an “other game statistic of its original form” not listed here, but it doesn’t need to be.
In other words, yes, you retain all flaws when you wild shape. Some flaws do have prerequisites, which aren’t as well-defined as those of feats, but are probably fair to treat much like feat prerequisites: if wild shape eliminates the prerequisite, it also eliminates the flaw. In most cases, without the prerequisite, the flaw won’t make much sense anyway. But if you find a case where that isn’t the case, since flaws are under-defined, I would expect the DM to make an ad hoc decision on it.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
So, if a flaw that had a prerequisite is temporarily eliminated by a wild shape, would the bonus feat granted by the flaw (effectively a hidden prerequisite to the feat in question) also get temporarily negated?
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 12 at 19:51
$begingroup$
@nijineko I would not say so; the flaw is not a prerequisite for the feat, it is how you got the feat. Really it is a case for an ad hoc decision as I said—really, I don’t even know of any way of ending up in that situation in the first place, and it is hard to discuss such a hypothetical. But generally I would want to avoid lost feats as much as possible.
$endgroup$
– KRyan
May 12 at 20:41
$begingroup$
Fair enough. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 13 at 21:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You keep your flaws as well as your feats
There is nothing that states that you would lose any feats upon wildshaping, and thus neither would you lose any flaws. It may however be the case that you lose the benefit of a certain feat due to your new form. For example, if you take rapid shot but turn into an animal that can not use ranged weaponry, you still have the feat but it won't benefit you.
The same may go for flaws. If a new form would somehow mean that the flaw you chose is no longer defficient to you, then you do temporarily lose the flaw and thus the feat you 'bought' with it. I do not see this happening often, though.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
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active
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$begingroup$
Let’s start by establishing what rules we do have:
Wild Shape (Su)
At 5th level, [...] This ability functions like the alternate form special ability, except as noted here.
Nothing “noted here” says anything about feats.
Alternate Form
A creature with this special quality has the ability to assume one or more specific alternate forms. [...]
- Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to) [...] feats [...]
Again, nothing “elsewhere,” either in alternate form or wild shape, contradicts the general statement that the creatures retains its feats.
Prerequisites
Some feats have prerequisites. Your character must have the indicated ability score, class feature, feat, skill, base attack bonus, or other quality designated in order to select or use that feat. A character can gain a feat at the same level at which he or she gains the prerequisite.
A character can’t use a feat if he or she has lost a prerequisite.
Here is the only thing that suggests a druid might lose (the use of) a feat when using wild shape: if the druid loses the prerequisites for that feat. This might be due to changed ability scores, loss of features from the druid’s original form, or whatever else—see the full description of alternate form for a full list of things a druid might lose during wild shape, and compare that against the prerequisites of any feats the druid may have.
Now then,
Character Flaws
Flaws are like the flip side of feats. Whereas a feat enables a character to be better than normal at performing a task (or even to do something that normal characters can't), a flaw restricts a character's capabilities or imposes a penalty of some sort.
A player may select up to two flaws when creating a character. After 1st level, a character cannot take on additional flaws unless the game master specifically allows it (for examples of times when doing this might be appropriate, see Character Traits). Each flaw a player selects entitles his character to a bonus feat. In other words, when you create a character, if you select two flaws, you can also take two bonus feats beyond those your character would be normally entitled to.
Unlike traits, flaws are entirely negative in their impact on a character's capabilities.
So here we have flaws as “the flip side of feats,” and each functions like a “negative” feat, both in having a negative impact on your character and in allowing you to take another feat to balance it out. Moreover, remember what alternate form said: “Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to)”—this is where flaws would fall, an “other game statistic of its original form” not listed here, but it doesn’t need to be.
In other words, yes, you retain all flaws when you wild shape. Some flaws do have prerequisites, which aren’t as well-defined as those of feats, but are probably fair to treat much like feat prerequisites: if wild shape eliminates the prerequisite, it also eliminates the flaw. In most cases, without the prerequisite, the flaw won’t make much sense anyway. But if you find a case where that isn’t the case, since flaws are under-defined, I would expect the DM to make an ad hoc decision on it.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
So, if a flaw that had a prerequisite is temporarily eliminated by a wild shape, would the bonus feat granted by the flaw (effectively a hidden prerequisite to the feat in question) also get temporarily negated?
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 12 at 19:51
$begingroup$
@nijineko I would not say so; the flaw is not a prerequisite for the feat, it is how you got the feat. Really it is a case for an ad hoc decision as I said—really, I don’t even know of any way of ending up in that situation in the first place, and it is hard to discuss such a hypothetical. But generally I would want to avoid lost feats as much as possible.
$endgroup$
– KRyan
May 12 at 20:41
$begingroup$
Fair enough. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 13 at 21:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let’s start by establishing what rules we do have:
Wild Shape (Su)
At 5th level, [...] This ability functions like the alternate form special ability, except as noted here.
Nothing “noted here” says anything about feats.
Alternate Form
A creature with this special quality has the ability to assume one or more specific alternate forms. [...]
- Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to) [...] feats [...]
Again, nothing “elsewhere,” either in alternate form or wild shape, contradicts the general statement that the creatures retains its feats.
Prerequisites
Some feats have prerequisites. Your character must have the indicated ability score, class feature, feat, skill, base attack bonus, or other quality designated in order to select or use that feat. A character can gain a feat at the same level at which he or she gains the prerequisite.
A character can’t use a feat if he or she has lost a prerequisite.
Here is the only thing that suggests a druid might lose (the use of) a feat when using wild shape: if the druid loses the prerequisites for that feat. This might be due to changed ability scores, loss of features from the druid’s original form, or whatever else—see the full description of alternate form for a full list of things a druid might lose during wild shape, and compare that against the prerequisites of any feats the druid may have.
Now then,
Character Flaws
Flaws are like the flip side of feats. Whereas a feat enables a character to be better than normal at performing a task (or even to do something that normal characters can't), a flaw restricts a character's capabilities or imposes a penalty of some sort.
A player may select up to two flaws when creating a character. After 1st level, a character cannot take on additional flaws unless the game master specifically allows it (for examples of times when doing this might be appropriate, see Character Traits). Each flaw a player selects entitles his character to a bonus feat. In other words, when you create a character, if you select two flaws, you can also take two bonus feats beyond those your character would be normally entitled to.
Unlike traits, flaws are entirely negative in their impact on a character's capabilities.
So here we have flaws as “the flip side of feats,” and each functions like a “negative” feat, both in having a negative impact on your character and in allowing you to take another feat to balance it out. Moreover, remember what alternate form said: “Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to)”—this is where flaws would fall, an “other game statistic of its original form” not listed here, but it doesn’t need to be.
In other words, yes, you retain all flaws when you wild shape. Some flaws do have prerequisites, which aren’t as well-defined as those of feats, but are probably fair to treat much like feat prerequisites: if wild shape eliminates the prerequisite, it also eliminates the flaw. In most cases, without the prerequisite, the flaw won’t make much sense anyway. But if you find a case where that isn’t the case, since flaws are under-defined, I would expect the DM to make an ad hoc decision on it.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
So, if a flaw that had a prerequisite is temporarily eliminated by a wild shape, would the bonus feat granted by the flaw (effectively a hidden prerequisite to the feat in question) also get temporarily negated?
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 12 at 19:51
$begingroup$
@nijineko I would not say so; the flaw is not a prerequisite for the feat, it is how you got the feat. Really it is a case for an ad hoc decision as I said—really, I don’t even know of any way of ending up in that situation in the first place, and it is hard to discuss such a hypothetical. But generally I would want to avoid lost feats as much as possible.
$endgroup$
– KRyan
May 12 at 20:41
$begingroup$
Fair enough. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 13 at 21:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let’s start by establishing what rules we do have:
Wild Shape (Su)
At 5th level, [...] This ability functions like the alternate form special ability, except as noted here.
Nothing “noted here” says anything about feats.
Alternate Form
A creature with this special quality has the ability to assume one or more specific alternate forms. [...]
- Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to) [...] feats [...]
Again, nothing “elsewhere,” either in alternate form or wild shape, contradicts the general statement that the creatures retains its feats.
Prerequisites
Some feats have prerequisites. Your character must have the indicated ability score, class feature, feat, skill, base attack bonus, or other quality designated in order to select or use that feat. A character can gain a feat at the same level at which he or she gains the prerequisite.
A character can’t use a feat if he or she has lost a prerequisite.
Here is the only thing that suggests a druid might lose (the use of) a feat when using wild shape: if the druid loses the prerequisites for that feat. This might be due to changed ability scores, loss of features from the druid’s original form, or whatever else—see the full description of alternate form for a full list of things a druid might lose during wild shape, and compare that against the prerequisites of any feats the druid may have.
Now then,
Character Flaws
Flaws are like the flip side of feats. Whereas a feat enables a character to be better than normal at performing a task (or even to do something that normal characters can't), a flaw restricts a character's capabilities or imposes a penalty of some sort.
A player may select up to two flaws when creating a character. After 1st level, a character cannot take on additional flaws unless the game master specifically allows it (for examples of times when doing this might be appropriate, see Character Traits). Each flaw a player selects entitles his character to a bonus feat. In other words, when you create a character, if you select two flaws, you can also take two bonus feats beyond those your character would be normally entitled to.
Unlike traits, flaws are entirely negative in their impact on a character's capabilities.
So here we have flaws as “the flip side of feats,” and each functions like a “negative” feat, both in having a negative impact on your character and in allowing you to take another feat to balance it out. Moreover, remember what alternate form said: “Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to)”—this is where flaws would fall, an “other game statistic of its original form” not listed here, but it doesn’t need to be.
In other words, yes, you retain all flaws when you wild shape. Some flaws do have prerequisites, which aren’t as well-defined as those of feats, but are probably fair to treat much like feat prerequisites: if wild shape eliminates the prerequisite, it also eliminates the flaw. In most cases, without the prerequisite, the flaw won’t make much sense anyway. But if you find a case where that isn’t the case, since flaws are under-defined, I would expect the DM to make an ad hoc decision on it.
$endgroup$
Let’s start by establishing what rules we do have:
Wild Shape (Su)
At 5th level, [...] This ability functions like the alternate form special ability, except as noted here.
Nothing “noted here” says anything about feats.
Alternate Form
A creature with this special quality has the ability to assume one or more specific alternate forms. [...]
- Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to) [...] feats [...]
Again, nothing “elsewhere,” either in alternate form or wild shape, contradicts the general statement that the creatures retains its feats.
Prerequisites
Some feats have prerequisites. Your character must have the indicated ability score, class feature, feat, skill, base attack bonus, or other quality designated in order to select or use that feat. A character can gain a feat at the same level at which he or she gains the prerequisite.
A character can’t use a feat if he or she has lost a prerequisite.
Here is the only thing that suggests a druid might lose (the use of) a feat when using wild shape: if the druid loses the prerequisites for that feat. This might be due to changed ability scores, loss of features from the druid’s original form, or whatever else—see the full description of alternate form for a full list of things a druid might lose during wild shape, and compare that against the prerequisites of any feats the druid may have.
Now then,
Character Flaws
Flaws are like the flip side of feats. Whereas a feat enables a character to be better than normal at performing a task (or even to do something that normal characters can't), a flaw restricts a character's capabilities or imposes a penalty of some sort.
A player may select up to two flaws when creating a character. After 1st level, a character cannot take on additional flaws unless the game master specifically allows it (for examples of times when doing this might be appropriate, see Character Traits). Each flaw a player selects entitles his character to a bonus feat. In other words, when you create a character, if you select two flaws, you can also take two bonus feats beyond those your character would be normally entitled to.
Unlike traits, flaws are entirely negative in their impact on a character's capabilities.
So here we have flaws as “the flip side of feats,” and each functions like a “negative” feat, both in having a negative impact on your character and in allowing you to take another feat to balance it out. Moreover, remember what alternate form said: “Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to)”—this is where flaws would fall, an “other game statistic of its original form” not listed here, but it doesn’t need to be.
In other words, yes, you retain all flaws when you wild shape. Some flaws do have prerequisites, which aren’t as well-defined as those of feats, but are probably fair to treat much like feat prerequisites: if wild shape eliminates the prerequisite, it also eliminates the flaw. In most cases, without the prerequisite, the flaw won’t make much sense anyway. But if you find a case where that isn’t the case, since flaws are under-defined, I would expect the DM to make an ad hoc decision on it.
edited May 12 at 0:54
answered May 11 at 21:41
KRyanKRyan
227k32568971
227k32568971
$begingroup$
So, if a flaw that had a prerequisite is temporarily eliminated by a wild shape, would the bonus feat granted by the flaw (effectively a hidden prerequisite to the feat in question) also get temporarily negated?
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 12 at 19:51
$begingroup$
@nijineko I would not say so; the flaw is not a prerequisite for the feat, it is how you got the feat. Really it is a case for an ad hoc decision as I said—really, I don’t even know of any way of ending up in that situation in the first place, and it is hard to discuss such a hypothetical. But generally I would want to avoid lost feats as much as possible.
$endgroup$
– KRyan
May 12 at 20:41
$begingroup$
Fair enough. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 13 at 21:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
So, if a flaw that had a prerequisite is temporarily eliminated by a wild shape, would the bonus feat granted by the flaw (effectively a hidden prerequisite to the feat in question) also get temporarily negated?
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 12 at 19:51
$begingroup$
@nijineko I would not say so; the flaw is not a prerequisite for the feat, it is how you got the feat. Really it is a case for an ad hoc decision as I said—really, I don’t even know of any way of ending up in that situation in the first place, and it is hard to discuss such a hypothetical. But generally I would want to avoid lost feats as much as possible.
$endgroup$
– KRyan
May 12 at 20:41
$begingroup$
Fair enough. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 13 at 21:45
$begingroup$
So, if a flaw that had a prerequisite is temporarily eliminated by a wild shape, would the bonus feat granted by the flaw (effectively a hidden prerequisite to the feat in question) also get temporarily negated?
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 12 at 19:51
$begingroup$
So, if a flaw that had a prerequisite is temporarily eliminated by a wild shape, would the bonus feat granted by the flaw (effectively a hidden prerequisite to the feat in question) also get temporarily negated?
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 12 at 19:51
$begingroup$
@nijineko I would not say so; the flaw is not a prerequisite for the feat, it is how you got the feat. Really it is a case for an ad hoc decision as I said—really, I don’t even know of any way of ending up in that situation in the first place, and it is hard to discuss such a hypothetical. But generally I would want to avoid lost feats as much as possible.
$endgroup$
– KRyan
May 12 at 20:41
$begingroup$
@nijineko I would not say so; the flaw is not a prerequisite for the feat, it is how you got the feat. Really it is a case for an ad hoc decision as I said—really, I don’t even know of any way of ending up in that situation in the first place, and it is hard to discuss such a hypothetical. But generally I would want to avoid lost feats as much as possible.
$endgroup$
– KRyan
May 12 at 20:41
$begingroup$
Fair enough. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 13 at 21:45
$begingroup$
Fair enough. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– nijineko
May 13 at 21:45
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You keep your flaws as well as your feats
There is nothing that states that you would lose any feats upon wildshaping, and thus neither would you lose any flaws. It may however be the case that you lose the benefit of a certain feat due to your new form. For example, if you take rapid shot but turn into an animal that can not use ranged weaponry, you still have the feat but it won't benefit you.
The same may go for flaws. If a new form would somehow mean that the flaw you chose is no longer defficient to you, then you do temporarily lose the flaw and thus the feat you 'bought' with it. I do not see this happening often, though.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You keep your flaws as well as your feats
There is nothing that states that you would lose any feats upon wildshaping, and thus neither would you lose any flaws. It may however be the case that you lose the benefit of a certain feat due to your new form. For example, if you take rapid shot but turn into an animal that can not use ranged weaponry, you still have the feat but it won't benefit you.
The same may go for flaws. If a new form would somehow mean that the flaw you chose is no longer defficient to you, then you do temporarily lose the flaw and thus the feat you 'bought' with it. I do not see this happening often, though.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You keep your flaws as well as your feats
There is nothing that states that you would lose any feats upon wildshaping, and thus neither would you lose any flaws. It may however be the case that you lose the benefit of a certain feat due to your new form. For example, if you take rapid shot but turn into an animal that can not use ranged weaponry, you still have the feat but it won't benefit you.
The same may go for flaws. If a new form would somehow mean that the flaw you chose is no longer defficient to you, then you do temporarily lose the flaw and thus the feat you 'bought' with it. I do not see this happening often, though.
$endgroup$
You keep your flaws as well as your feats
There is nothing that states that you would lose any feats upon wildshaping, and thus neither would you lose any flaws. It may however be the case that you lose the benefit of a certain feat due to your new form. For example, if you take rapid shot but turn into an animal that can not use ranged weaponry, you still have the feat but it won't benefit you.
The same may go for flaws. If a new form would somehow mean that the flaw you chose is no longer defficient to you, then you do temporarily lose the flaw and thus the feat you 'bought' with it. I do not see this happening often, though.
edited May 12 at 2:18
V2Blast
29.4k5106178
29.4k5106178
answered May 11 at 20:51
ArthabanArthaban
3,6701349
3,6701349
add a comment |
add a comment |
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